This is the episode transcribed. This is the episode transcribed.

This is the episode transcribed. This is the episode transcribed.

This is the episode transcribed. This is the episode transcribed.

Welcome, friends. You found just Janilee and Larissa again. At the corner of this is art and it's so cool and relating to it so much that I just threw away the introduction. Let's jump back in with act two of the musical next to Normal, where we left off. I'm so excited. Yeah, Larissa is, like, super excited. I'm so happy that you're loving it so much. See, this is just so fun to be able to share art and especially when you can take it bit by bit and talk about it while you do it. It's amazing. I love it. So, where we left off, Larissa, do you remember?  Yes.  She agrees to the ECT and the daughter is.  Taking the pills from her mom's cabinet, and the dad is  hoping for the light at the end of the tunnel. And it's the first time that the mom looks at the dad and doesn't actually acknowledge the son who passed. Yeah. Gape outline or whatever it is in the corner. I mean, we don't know. He literally has a song where he's like, am I spirit or flesh and blood? We don't know  whatever he is. Quick reminder of names. The mom's name is Diana. The father's name is Dan. The son's name is Gabe. The daughter's name is Natalie. And Natalie has a little bit of a love interest named Henry. I was going to call him Howard, so I'm glad it's all good. You had started with an H.  They have a chorus of three songs that we'll go through in the second act, and they're called Hey. So it's Hey number one, Hey number two, and Hey number three. And, um.  Basically, the only reason I remember Henry is because his name rhymes with the words in the previous line. So, anyway, you'll listen to it, you'll get obsessed with it, and you won't have to worry. It's fine. I'm so excited to listen to the music, too. Later. Yeah, it's really fun. I listen to it a lot. Okay, so we come back in, and  the first charact characters we see are Natalie and Henry. So  we have Natalie being like, come on, it's my favorite club. Let's go in. And Henry's like, dude, this is your third one in one night, and it's a Tuesday, so we kind of know that Natalie is a little off the deep end. She kind of took it too far, right? And so she's like, It's my favorite song. Henry's like, every song is your favorite song. Like, this is an excuse you use often.  And so he's like, what exactly are you on? And she's like, Adderall, Xanax, Valium, Robitussin, all of the medications, right? And then Henry  antipsychotics. Right? So Henry just makes an interesting comment. When did you become a bad influence on me?  And even though and here's and this kind of relates back to what we were talking about earlier, I am not of the opinion that Henry is ever a bad influence on Natalie. I think he influences her to loosen up. But this is Natalie going too far and coping in an unhealthy way and becoming a bad influence on Henry. Natalie uses the example that we're all thinking, right? Like, hey, my mom's in the hospital. She's going to get electrocuted. So back off, essentially, right? So we're reminded that this ECT is about to happen.  The stage kind of has like a split screen. So on one side of the stage, we see Natalie and Henry in this club, and on the other side of the stage, we see Dr. Madden with Diana, right? So  it happens in the song that's about to start, and it also happens in the dialogue. You have Dr. Madden talking and then Natalie talking. And again, it's one of those where what Dr. Madden is saying could apply to Natalie kind of thing. She's talking about, like the ECT. She gives us a little bit of a timeline. She gets it like every day for two weeks. I'd never let them fuck with my brain like that, right? This corrects me. Yeah. Although she is letting the pills screw with her brain. No big deal. Exactly. Because literally what she does right after that is she pops the pill and downs it with a Red Bull. And Henry goes, no, you're strictly a do it yourselfer, right? I would never let them fuck with my brain like that. No, you just want to do it yourself. Right? It's this idea of whether it's ECT or drugs, both of them are messing with your brain. So we have Dr. Madden. He's like, here's your anesthesiologist. For those who don't know, it's just the person who makes you go to sleep before procedures. So breathe normally, relax, count backwards, everything. And then the song starts. So the song is called Wish I Were Here. And it starts with a very loud, like, rock note. And so this is something where Lariss and I were going to talk about the music on a Patreon only video. But it's basically this rock music is when the therapy is really intense and it's kind of like representing a certain aspect of her, right? And so it's this part that's a little defensive and protective of herself. And so it's not a slow song. It's very upbeat, it's very fast and it's like in an instant lightning flashes and the burst could leave me blind. A bold of lightning burns through my mind and so she's like it's like someone drained my brain out, set my frozen mind to thaw, letting the lethargy and pain out while I stood and watched in awe. So she's having this kind of out of body experience where and mean we see this often in media where  your body is unconscious on the table but you're standing over looking down at yourself, right? Yeah. And so she's having this and she's watching. And they told me it would change me, though they don't know how it does. So again, we're touching back in on that fear. I don't exactly know how this is going to change me, but this is the last option. Nothing else has worked, so I'm willing to try it. And so I've lived life of clouds and gray but this is crystal clear. Wish I were here similar to how she was saying that she misses the mountains. Like all of this stuff is perfect, but it's not real. And so she's like the only things that have ever been real are these clouds of gray. But I wish I was here. I imagine that it's remarkable, exuberant austere. And then we have Natalie come in, right? So, again, messing with our brains in two different ways here. Natalie, it's euphoria, it's anger, it's the winter wind, it's fire, it kills my deepest hunger and it fills me with desire. And I find it interesting because both of them are messing with their brains in one way, but one of them, it's like, okay, this is the last option. Kind of resigned, right, with Diana. But Natalie is almost chasing down a high. Yeah, she's chasing that dragon. Yeah. It's exuberant, it's fire. It's my deepest desire. And then both of them start singing. It's the light and heat from every sun. It's a bullet from a magic gun. I'm going to try and enjoy it, but I'm missing all the fun. Am I feeling what I think I'm feeling? The hope, the heat, the fear? Well, wish I was here. Is this just someone else's head trip? Do I just disappear? I don't know. Just wish I was here. And so then in the middle of the song, they have this conversation where Diana's like, what are you doing in my electricity? And Natalie's like, it's always about you. I'm robotripping. I can't even feel my legs. And Diana's like, I don't want you doing drugs. And Natalie goes, oh, that's persuasive coming from the Pfizer woman of the year. You're the one who's hallucinating.  See? And this is something I love about this musical as well. It makes you laugh. This is not a light topic, but we're laughing because it's funny, right? Yeah. And so Diana's like, it's my treatment. It's a miracle. Everything is different now. And Natalie goes, I know what you mean. So they both start singing again. Plug me in, turn me on, flip the switch, as good as gone. And so is my brain reborn or is it wrecked? It's kind of nothing space, right, where we don't really know what's happening. But at least it's something for Diana, at least it's a chance. And for Natalie, at least I can't numb myself out from all of the hardness of my life. So I'm just going to do it this way. I'm in the hospital,  the gurney and the nurses go, so, like, the procedure is over. And back in the club, like, Natalie collapses and Henry is just like the fifth night in the row that I've had to confine you at some random club. So we know that Henry's kind of taking care of Natalie in this instance, right, where she's gone off the deep end. But he's not going to abandon her. He's sticking with her, kind of in the way that Dan is sticking with Diana. And there's another interesting comparison of Henry is doing it because we'll find out later in one of the songs. It's different than the way Dan's doing it. It's almost like Henry's doing it for Natalie, but Dan's doing it for Dan. Exactly. Well, and Dan is not really being he's physically there.  But he's not mentally there. Yeah, he's checked out in his own little dissociative fugue, whereas it sounds like Henry's still fully cognizant. I mean, he might be high, but yeah, well, and not nearly as bad. He's aware enough to at least ask, like, what are you on? Right. Dan has never really asked Diana this and that. She's like, is this treatment working? Are going to be stable again? But not, why are you doing this? And the other but they both are physically definitely present there. Well, and I know that they're doing the best they can given the situation, but  it's still falling short. So then we have Dan, and he shows up at the hospital, and he's like, Diana. And we know that something's a little off because it takes Diana a moment. She goes dan right. Like, it's an effort to remember his name, right. And remember one of the side effects was memory loss. So Dan's like, hey, your two weeks are up. You can come home now. And she's like, home. Dan's bringing Diana home, and Natalie and Henry are in Natalie's room, and so Natalie is like, okay, you can leave now. I'm like, 70% less messed up than I was. And Henry just kind of sits there, and she's like, no, seriously, my dad's going to be home with my mom. I don't want them to see you.  My mom's coming home from the hospital like, you don't want to be here. Get out of here. And so Henry's like, well, will you call me? And Natalie's like, just leave. Right. Not answering the question. Just like, thanks for being there and bringing me home when I passed out, but I don't want you here anymore because I don't need you here anymore. Yeah, peace out kind of a thing. Natalie has some lines in the song. She goes, can I hide my stupid hunger? Fake some confidence and cheer. Wish I was here. It's interesting because it's fake some confidence and cheer. It's like she's very intentionally putting on a specific mask when she's interacting with her parents, and the only person who's actually seeing her in all of her glory is Henry, and it's not very pretty at the moment. No. Yeah. But he still isn't abandoning her, and she has this huge fear of abandonment, obviously, because both of her parents kind of have yeah, for sure. Dan and Diana come home, and Natalie's like, hey, you look great. And Diana's like, thanks. Who are you? And Natalie's like, who am I? And. And dan's like this is Natalie. And Natalie actually goes, I'm your daughter. This is a very basic thing. And Dan is like, oh,  of course. Is this our house? And so we start to realize that she's lost more memory than she wanted would be ideal, right? Yeah. And so Dan kind of realizes, like, you don't remember any of this. And Dan is like, I should. Huh? And so there's a song called A Song of Forgetting. Dan and Diana kind of walk through, like, these are the rooms. This is where we had Christmas. We have the paint, the walls, the glass, the ceiling, and you don't recall anything.  Then start showing her pictures. This is our house on Walton Way. It had a red door. We spent a whole weekend downtown. And Natalie's like, this is where I took my first few steps and lost my tooth. Nothing. And Dana's like, no. So they keep singing, right? Showing more pictures. Sing a song of forgetting a song of the way things were not sing of what's lost to you of times that you never knew. Sing of not remembering when of memories that go unremembered and then sing a song of forgetting again  it's so interesting because it says remembering and memories a lot, and it can get easy to get lost in it. But you singing a song of not remembering when of memories that go unremembered. And then what happens when memories are unremembered. Right. To a certain extent, we're not going to remember everything. But I also find it interesting, even though this was caused by the ECT in this play, a lot of trauma survivors don't have a memory. They see pictures and they're like, yeah, sure, that looks like me, but okay, I don't remember this. And it's a feeling of not feeling connected to anything. Not feeling connected to a past. Like, yes, it's a new start, blah, blah, blah. But  what good is a new start without a past? Yeah. Or being able to fill in the past. Exactly. Yeah. And that's a hard thing to do.  I just have to remind myself of that because there's so much I don't know. But that doesn't mean that I haven't built a life that's worth remembering. And I do have a past. It's just not my entire life. It's just a couple of years. Well, and I don't know. For those of you out there that are not familiar with ECT therapy, I have had a couple of patients who have gone through it.  Some of those memories do come back over time. And I feel like that fog as I left the abusive situations that I was in, that fog lifted more and more on certain things I went through, but not others, if that makes sense. And so certain things, I was able to be like, oh, yeah, I remember this now. Whereas other things I was like, I have no clue that happened. Oh, okay. This is so fun. When I was thinking about this show that I was listening to the songs, and there was one line that I'm like, I know what I'm going to say about that, or I know how Larissa is going to think about that. So I'm just happy about it. Thank you for letting me share this with you. It's so exciting for me. Oh, I'm sitting here, like, on the edge of my seat.  Okay, so I won't make you wait. And so she remembers, like, the day we met, we shared two beers,  and Dan's kind of like, okay. And then what? She's like, I don't know. I forgot. And so Dan is like, well, Dr. Mitchell said that there might be some memory loss. And dan's like it's. Dr. Madden. Okay, well, see, there you go. Like, I lost some memory. So then Natalie gets really angry, right? And she's like, what a lovely cure. Because remember, Dan went through this whole no, let's not do ECT. Okay, fine. This is the only option we have. And just kind of assumed that everyone else would have that same epiphany. But Natalie never had that. She was just angry and against it. Nobody sat down with her. Yeah, and now look, I was right. What a lovely cure. With a mind so pure. She doesn't know anything. And Dan's like, well, it's there, I'm sure, because memories, they don't die. And so we're going to sing a song of forgetting, a song of the way things were. Not sing. Course. So Natalie goes off to school, runs into Henry, and we have the song. Hey. And Henry is just like, hey, I've missed you. I've been calling you. She's like, I've been busy. And he's like, have you been on the scene? Have you been to the clubs? You look like a mess. She's like, thanks.  And Henry goes, Are you clean? And Natalie, instead of taking this as you're kind of caring, she just turns around and attacks Henry. And kudos to Henry for how he takes it. She's like, wow, coming from you, right? Because he's the reason that she took her first hit of marijuana. Yeah, but that doesn't equate to everything else, right? And he's like, I don't do what you do. Yeah, exactly. He's like, I don't do what you do. She's like, okay, but how did it start? And he's like, you took it too far. Because remember, Henry has a very controlled relationship with his marijuana. And she's like, oh, I took it to getting really angry. And Henry's like, hey, calm calm down. She's like, don't do that. He's like, are we over? Don't say that we're over. And she's like, well, don't you want us to be? And he's like, no, I want the person that I knew. I know that she's somewhere in there. She's some in.  And there's just kind of like this awkward moment. And then Henry's like, look, there's a school dance. It's cheesy, it's blah, blah, blah, you know, but I'll be there. It would be nice if you come. And she's like, I don't do dances. He's like, Just go to the dance for me, then. And she's like, bye. And then just walks away, and he chases her, and she just doesn't turn back. So, you know, he's helped her through all of these things, but she's just this level of emotional vulnerability that she's not able to get in. I don't think that it's because she doesn't care. I think she really cares about Henry. But how do you be emotionally vulnerable when you've never been taught it? Being emotionally vulnerable means accepting how shitty your life is. And it's not just that. It's that she's been taught that emotional vulnerability equates to psychosis, the normal, the stereotypical, the healthy, the socially acceptable dissociation is to have no emotions, to be in that state. And so she's thinking that that's all she can do and that's all she's really been taught is acceptable. And so she doesn't know any different either. Yeah, that's all that's been modeled. I mean, she has two ways of dealing with things, the way her dad has or the way her mom has. And her mom is in a hospital and just lost her memory, so she obviously doesn't want to go down that track. Yeah, and what's interesting is that she's kind of doing both, though, because she's on the scene, she's taking these drugs, but she's also refusing to engage the way that her dad does. It's a very interesting combination of the two ways that she have been modeled for her to cope. Yeah. So cool. Yeah, well, and, I mean, she hasn't been in her mom's head to understand what her mom emotionally is going through. And she's not at an age where she can learn her own coping skills yet. She's just a teenager. She's just a baby. Still. So fun. Sorry. I love how much conversation that can come from this. So good.  So Dan's talking with Dr. Madden, and there's a song called Seconds and Years where he's like, hey, a little loss of memory is normal. So before the song starts, he's like, we have a little timeline where Dan's like, it's been two weeks. So it's been two weeks since she came home. A little loss of memory is normal and helpful in forgetting all your fears. And Dan goes, I couldn't give a flying fuck what's normal. We haven't had a normal day in years. Yeah, I mean, it's true, right? And so Dr. Madden trying to help them stay engaged because this is a hard part of healing. He starts asking Diana, like, are things becoming clearer with the treatment? And she's like, yeah. Is life less cloudy than it was before?  Yeah, right? Like what she does remember is less cloudy, right? Do you still feel that your head is filled with concrete? She goes, no. And then I love this throwback and you're not a scary rock star anymore. And he goes, okay, like that part doesn't really make sense to him, but it makes sense to the audience. So we get a nice little laugh, right? Yeah. And Dan's like, well, what about her memory? Because that's what we're worried about. Than a new song better than before. Like I said, most of this musical songs and he's like, the memories are there somewhere, so find some pictures, some keepsakes and things you can show her. And Dan goes, should I bring up the subject of  Gabe? Right. He doesn't say it, but we know he's referring to Gabe. Yeah, he's afraid to say the name. Yeah, he actually hasn't said Gabe this entire musical. He only says it once, but that's a spoiler. Okay. Dr. Madden's like yes. Keep it light at first. Careful that she's not distressed, but when the time's right, tell her. Remind her of things. So Dan's like, okay, let's start with something small. I bet you know what these shiny things are. She's like Trinkets from Atlantic City. And Dan's like, well, there are wedding rings, but not quite close, but no cigar. Yeah. So Natalie and Dan are all there and Natalie's being really sarcastic when he's like, actually, there are wedding rings. Natalie goes, it's going well. I love how sarcastic she is. It's amazing. Dan actually takes this opportunity of the fact that Diana doesn't know anything and he does something that could very easily be seen as a villainous act, but we kind of can understand. He decides to tweak history a little bit. Since she doesn't quite remember things, he's going to just tweak it a little bit. So, for instance, here's a flower from our wedding. It was such a sight to see. The ceremony was everything that we'd ever hoped. And Natalie goes,  dad and Dad's like, hey, that's the way I remember it. So that's how it'll be. And it's interesting. I love this, too, because it's like natalie responds like, it was raining. It was Portland. You eloped. I mean, Portland, right? She's like, seriously, your wedding was not everything you thought it was. It's not everything you're saying it was. And Dan goes, it's an open book to write here. It's a life we can restore, we can get back to what we had and maybe more we can get us back to better than before. And so it's kind of like it puts the audience again in this awkward situation of like, I get it. Like, Dan has tried to forget all of these things.  But is it okay for him to do it at the expense of not telling his wife the way things were? I mean, no, exactly. What's the harm in thinking that you had a great wedding when you didn't? So I've taken a lot of ethics classes, and I know the harm. Well, I don't think Daniel has. No, obviously he's taken architecture. They probably don't need a lot of ethics. And architecture  mean don't make a building that's going to fall. Yeah. So Natalie goes on, and she's like, hey, we're missing a few pictures, aren't we? And we start to know that's kind of like our indication, because Dan's like, oh, the doctor said only do that at the right time. So in this history, he's tweaking the little things, but he's also completely leaving out everything about Gabe. So here's one of our vacations. We saw the Painted Desert, Grand Canyon, Aunt Rhonda, and Natalie learned what her middle finger meant. We're going down the memory lane, and it's really fun. Here's the first house we owned. And Diana starts to get engaged just a little. She's like, hey, we're by a lake with all these ducks. Who's this chubby little girl? And Dan goes, that's Natalie. And Natalie goes, this sucks. Which, again, loves a teenage angst. So she starts to leave, but Dan stops her and is like, hey, help. Help me do this. And so Natalie is like, okay, fine. Here's the headline in the paper when you freaked out at the market. Here's the house on Walton Way after the fire. And dan's like Natalie. And she's like, here's the damage to the Honda when you showed me how to park it. And Diana's like, oh, did we crush somebody's cat beneath the tire? And Natalie goes, yes. Ours pulls out some more pictures. Here's dad at my recital, and we're wondering where you are.  And so Natalie is just like, oh, you want me to remind her of things? Here's how my life has been. This is Natalie telling her life story of all of the hard things that define her. And it's interesting, because as soon as we start having more of these realistic things, that life wasn't all happy. We have a little sad here. Diana goes, I remember this. I made it to the school. And Dan's like, wait, you remember? She's like, yeah, it was the year of too much lithium. So I hit out in the car, and she picks up another picture. And this is Natalie's swim meet. I was in the pool. And Natalie's like, yeah, you are. Yeah, you weren't supposed to be, but you were right. And then Diana looks at Natalie and goes, your life has kind of sucked, I think. And Natalie goes, you got it. Yay hooray. We're getting a little bit of memory back. Damn. Still holding on to the hope that it can be better than before, that it can be primroses and pixies and none of the dragons and dust. Exactly, because that's all that we want. We always want to wish away the pain. So we're going through the things that end. We get to different keep stakes. And the song ends with Diana. She picks up a music box.  And she looks at it for a really long minute, and Dan realizes what happens, whisks it away. And then they just keep looking through the memories. But that reminded us that there's Gabe. And so Gabe comes on, and he has his song called Aftershocks. And so Gabe is speaking to Diana, but she's not hearing him like she has before. And so he's like, they've managed to get rid of me, return me to the gray wave ECT electric chair. We shock who we can't save. They've cleared you of my memories and many more as well. You may have wanted some of them, but who can ever tell? So we're getting a little scared, right? And so then we get back to this again, normal, quote, unquote, where your brain waves are more regular, the chemistry more pure, the headaches and the nausea will pass, and you'll endure. Your son is gone forever. Though of this the doctor sure the memories will wane, the aftershocks remain. And then this chilling line. You wonder which is worse, the symptom or the cure? So you have like, yes, this is helpful. The treatment has done what it's meant to do, right? Your brain waves are more regular, everything's working, like you're more chill. But is this really better? Is this really better? So it's almost like this whole entire play, we're going from one extreme to the other, of going absolutely crazy to absolutely nothing. Diana mentioned that. Bipolar. From manic to nothing. From manic to nothing scene changes. Diana's looking at some pictures, and Dan comes in and is like, hey, you've been at this for days. And she's like, there's something missing here. It's been tugging at my brain. Like I can almost see it. And Dan's like, oh, just come to bed. If the memories are meant to come back, they will. But he's helping her remember everything except a certain thing because he's afraid it will break her. It's his fear. Yeah, it's not her fear. It's his irrational fear. And it's not even irrational. I think it's partly based on his experience. Yes, but also how Diana reacted before. I mean, everything is Gabe's fault up to this point. The audience is having a little if we've been paying attention to all of his lyrics, we're not so sure. But if we can just keep Gabe out of the picture, we can keep this happy family and move forward to something better than we've ever had before. Yeah, the illusion of happy.  So Henry knocks on the door. Diana struggles to remember his name. And Henry. Right. And he's like, yeah. And she's like, you remind me of someone. How old are you? And he's like, 17. Why? She's like, I don't know.  You can go visit Natalie. Like, she's in a room, and so there's something there, and it's nagging at Diana, right? So the song keeps going, by the way. Gabe is like they've managed to get rid of me I'm gone without a trace but sear the soul and leave a scar no treatment can erase they cut away the cancer but forgot to fill the hole they moved me from your memory. I'm still there in your soul. Your life goes back to normal. Or so they all believe. Your heart is in your chest again, not hanging from your sleeve. They've driven out the demons and they've earned you this reprieve. The memories are gone. The aftershocks live on. But with nothing to remember, is there nothing left to grieve? And Diana sings with nothing to remember so we know that she's not seeing Gabe. She's not interacting with him, but something's missing, and she's kind of getting half of what he's saying. So Natalie and Henry, their relationship, it's hey number two. And he's like, So tomorrow's the dance. Like, I know it's stupid, but let's go. And she's like, no. And he's like, hey, I want to know who you are again. She's like, no, not now. He's like, okay, when I'll wait, just tell me for how long. And she's like, no, too late already. And she's like, hey, will you listen? And Henry's like, I've stayed by your side. And she's like, Just shut up and listen. And he's like, okay, but why do I keep getting denied? And she goes, you remind me of me and how fucked up I can be. And. And it's just kind of like yeah, because Henry is the healthy thing in her life and it's persistent and it won't leave.  She just wants to live in denial because denial is easier than accepting and working on yourself, quite honestly. Totally, yeah. He's like, okay, let's start over then. Clean slate. He pulls out the tickets, gives her one and says, the dance is tomorrow at eight. And she's like, you don't give up. And he's like, So don't give up on me. And she's like, Just goodbye, right? Like, each of these songs ends with, Goodbye, Henry. That's how I remember his name. Then don't give up on me. Goodbye, Henry. Anyway.  I mean, heart goes out to Henry. He's a good guy. So then we have a new song, You Don't Know, but the Reprise, which for those who don't know in musicals, it refers back to the song You Don't Know. But it's a slightly different version. And what I like about them is it usually continues on the story. So remember, You Don't Know was when she was like, you don't know what it's like to live this way. What it's like to die alive, to need help, to lift your head. And so she starts singing. She's like, It's been four weeks since the treatment, so it's been a full month. My mind is still a mess and what's left to be remembered? It's anybody's guess. My past is like the weather. It'll come and it will go. I don't know. I don't even know what I don't know. She's like, I'm some Christopher Columbus sailing out into my mind with no map of where I'm going or what I've left behind. There's something missing I wish it would show. I don't know. I don't know. And so Dr. Madden starts singing like, are you talking with your husband? Well, he doesn't really say much. Is it helping you remember? Well, I remember that he hasn't ever said much. And he's like, okay, so is the puzzle coming together piece by piece and row by row? And she's like, I don't know. I don't know where the fucking pieces go. Yeah, because I don't know how this started, so I don't know when it's done. And Dr. Madden goes, have you talked of your depression, your delusions and your son and. And the music just stops. And Diana goes, my what?  And Dr. Madden's like, your husband didn't I think you two should talk more.  Yeah, you might want to sit down and have that chat he's been avoiding. Right? But the thing is, Dr. Madden doesn't know that. Right? Like, it's been a month, and he trusted Dan to do that. That Diana is like, we should talk more. Like, that's it. I don't even remember marrying this man. It's not like I'm just some sexually frustrated soccer mom.  He's a stranger to me. He's like, interestingly. The underlying challenges are similar, but I'll see you next week. This conversation needs to happen. So the music changes. Diana is home alone. Gabe appears, holding the music box, and he hands it to Diana. She takes it without seeing him. She picked it up off the table or something, and she seems surprised to find it in her hands. So she stands there, opens the box, and kind of hums along with it. And then Gabe is humming, and all of a sudden, Dan appears, and the music just stops. And Diana goes, what is this? And Dan's like, Where did you get that? It's nothing. It's just an old music box. And Diana goes, we played it for the baby. Sometimes it helped him sleep. And Dan goes no. Diana. She's like, him. We did have a boy. And he goes, Diana, you shouldn't, because, like you said, he doesn't want this to happen. So she doesn't let him take the music box. And as she starts singing this next song, how could I ever forget Dan's? Like, It's not a good idea. Don't do this. And this is what I find interesting, like Larissa was mentioning with memories before they come back, very interesting. She literally just had a song where she doesn't remember anything, and it's so frustrating. And all of a sudden, she has this one memory and the detail. We were still living downtown my black coat thrown over my blue nightgown. I mean, that is crystal clear memory. That is not just, oh, sure, it's a scene in my head because I'm writing a story. No, that's crystal clear. You drove too fast. The lights of the city flew past. And Dan is just like, please don't. He doesn't want to relive this. He doesn't want her to remember this. And she's like, how could I ever forget? Outside, the morning was cool and wet. He had such chills but still he lay there, so still and just eight months old, so cold. We ran him inside, lost, worrying, wondering. That hospital room, the gloom.  So then we have Diana and Dan, and they're singing together.  Diana is like, how could I ever forget? And dan. How could I ever forget? And Diana goes screaming at doctors, alarmed, upset. And Dan goes, I was so upset. And so he's remembering, just a little. Diana keeps remembering. They said to wait. And then Dan's like, Diana, don't you think this will help? But it won't. But Diana keeps singing. She's like, they never said that we were too late, but I was a child raising a child. And then Dan goes, so many years ago, so much that we could not know, they're singing this together. And then Diana, those weeks full of joy, then a moment of dread. Someone simply said, your child is and then they both start singing. How could I ever forget? This was the moment my life was set that day that I lost you it's as clear as the day we met how could I ever forget? And I love that stanza because Diana's singing to Gabe, but Dan is singing to Diana. That moment I lost you it.  Was the moment that my life was set. For 17 years, they've lived this life defined by this one moment. And they've both been impact. All three of them have been impact in different ways. Yeah, I mean, I remember I remember the color in the room when my sister died.  You know that twilight color when it's blue, you don't get it everywhere. You you get it in states that are a little bit more northern. I remember the way the dust looked.  It's such a seared in memory,  and even if you can't access it for a while, it's there. And this is where there's a lot of people now, even still, who are like, well, if you do EMDR or ECT or whatever and you regain your memories, how do you even know they're real? How do you know they're not fake? This is how it's the level of detail. Detail. It's so seared in there. It's just that you finally moved a bookcase and you can see the wall. Yeah, you can see what's written on there clear as day. So memory retrieval in the brain. I don't know if you've covered this before. It's like train tracks, just like they're describing in their thing. And you have little roadmaps in your brain that become myelinated for the memories that you recover all the time. Like. How to drive a car, how to ride a bike, those types of things. It's myelinated. You can easily access it. And then the ones that you don't access very often, they just kind of disappear because they don't myelinate, they don't strengthen, they don't make that super fast highway. It's a dirt road. And eventually the road, you know, it doesn't mean that they disappear, it just means that they're harder to access, they require more effort. Yeah, the road to them disappears, the road washes away. Think of it like a road  and a flood comes and that's that ECT. Literally all of the electrical impulses that your brain uses to find the memories that they have that are myelinated changes. I mean, it's fascinating to see how a simple, tiny little volt, I mean, like I accidentally electrocuted myself, plugging my blow dryer in, wondering if I screwed up my brain at all type thing. Because you don't realize how much electricity can affect your brain and it's just stunning. If you want to listen back to episode 6.5 about neurobiology and neurophysiology, we talk about this. That episode is focused more on going forward and how we can create new habits, right? But it applies going backwards as well. The brain still works the way it works. I'm in tears remembering this memory because I remember all of that pain and all of what I went through in that moment. I've done EMDR for that. I mean, either I need a re up or it obviously was such an impactful thing listening to this play and the story and getting involved in it. You're crying, you're feeling your emotions. The only reason I'm not is because I did all my crying the first 102 hundred times I listened to this musical. Right? But I mean, it's helping you kind of process your emotions. Like art is helpful in that in so many different ways. And it reminds you of things in your life because it's a story that relates, even though the details aren't the same for you. It was a sister and the story, it's a child.  So Dan, to get back to the story here, dan says, why would you want to remember something that hurt you? And Diana goes, I want to remember everything. And she goes, how did he die? And Dan like, he was sick. Well, with what? Why wasn't he treated? What was wrong? Like these are normal questions that I'm sure she asked at the time as well. And he sings something the doctors all missed. The clinic, the Er, each specialist, they said babies cry, allergies gas. Who knows why? And I was a child raising a child. We stayed up all night, most nights. He slept at his side, but still he just cried and cried. Was it? And Diana, she's kind of trying. Things are slowly coming together and she's like, he was a baby when he died. But I remember him older.  And Dan goes, no, he was a baby. We should call Dr. Madden. And Diana is like, why would we call Dr. Madden? I'm just trying to make sense of this. What was his name? I don't even remember hearing you say his name. Why is that? And this is kind of the moment that we as an audience realize dan has never said his name. This entire play, Dan's. Like Diana. She's like, what was his name? Tell me. And then there the short little song, it's going to be Good, reprise, where before Dan was like, yeah, everything's going to be great. And this time he's like, It's going to be fine. We're going to go back to the doctor because we caught it just in time. We'll take the pills, pay the bills, and the whole song, Diana is going, what was his name? We'll do more ECT. What was his name? Our son. What was his name? It's going to be good. You'll see, like, what was his name? What was his name? So then a tuxedoed Henry appears and opens the front door, and he knocks, and no one answers. So he makes his way inside. After checking the time, Natalie comes from downstairs, and they both walk in at this kind of climax of the song of, what was his name? It's going to be good. What was his name? It's going to be good. What was his name? It's going to be good. She's trying to get one piece of information. Dan's trying to ignore her. The song ends with Natalie going, dad. And so the music kind of stops right there. Dan grabs the music box out of her hands and throws it on the ground. And that's when Natalie's like, dad. And then she just runs back upstairs. And then there's this song called Why Stay? And I love this because it puts on showcase for the first time the similarities between the relationship between Dan and Diana and the relationship between Henry and Natalie. And so we get to see this at the same time. So Diana is like, why would you stay? So steadfast and stolid, stoic and solid for day after every day? Why stay and not simply give in and get on with living? Because everyone knows you tried but something died, so why do you stay? And then Natalie starts singing to Henry, why stay? So both Diana and Natalie are singing here, enduring and coping and hurting and hoping for day after fucking day. Why stay? Why not simply end it? We'd all comprehend it. And most of the world would say he's better off that way to be free, and maybe so is she. Everyone would understand. Why do you stay? I think there's almost a double meaning to that. Like, why is this girl, why is this 1617 year old girl, Natalie, sticking around for this? I've never thought of that. That's true. Why? And why is the mom, Diana, sticking around for this pain when?  Don can't even handle the pain, and that's why he can't even say the name. Sorry, did not mean to rhyme there. I mean, like, all of the lines rhyme, but it's that inability to cope with the truth, and it's that human nature wanting to run away. Yeah. And not only would it be better for the guys to have ran away because then they could just escape it all, but these women could be escaping it all, too. And that's that last line. He's better off that way to be free. And maybe so. Is she right? Maybe Dan did Diana a disservice by staying think that Henry did, but that's just because they're teenagers and their relationship is only a couple of months old, but 17 years, it kind of keeps the relationship unmoving. So many families split up when a child gets sick with cancer or when a child dies. The likelihood of them divorce, of the parents divorcing is so much higher when a child dies in that family because they can't cope, because they're both just trying to survive in this crapshoot of a situation that's overwhelmingly heartbreaking. And the only way that it usually does survive, especially with that other child, is to be going through therapy together, like family therapy, individual therapy, grief therapy, all of the therapies. And the thing is there's such a social expectation of, no, you're going to let this split up your marriage. Well, here's the thing. Sometimes, especially if whether admitted or not, the child is the only thing keeping you together, sometimes it's a good thing to split up. Oh, yeah. I love seeing and it's like, in small ways, but like, hey, you got divorced. Let's celebrate that. You broke up with someone toxic, let's celebrate that. But no, all we're going to do is celebrate marriage and staying together and unity and family and not celebrate taking care of ourselves. And it's this really hard thing when you have those social pressures.  We can sit here and look at this because this is a piece of fiction. We're not going to offend anyone. But would it have been better for Dan to have left for Diana to have found a new place, not to leave her high and drying alone, but just say, hey, you can live with your parents. I'll live with my parents. This, that, like, you know, there could have been a different way forward that maybe was better yeah. Where this little girl might not have been nearly as neglected as well. And it's I mean, my parents stayed together when my sister died. Was that for the better or not? I don't know. I mean.  Were they miserable? Are they happy? I don't know. And I mean, it doesn't always have to be a death either.  I have a younger brother who had a very rare form of brain cancer and he got that when he was three years old. I was six years old. Was it better for my parents to stay together through that? Because most of my memories of abuse come from after my brother was stable. Was it just too much? Because I know my parents didn't seek help. And so there's this kind of, like, collateral damage thing. Which is why I think it's interesting that there is this other daughter of parents aren't taking care of themselves and is this inadvertently hurting other people? Yeah, well and I mean, my parents were getting ready to split up when my sister got diagnosed with hers. And hers was a very rare form of cancer too. I mean, just random, weird stuff where we have these parallels and they parallel with this musical too. But so they stayed together because they didn't want her to blame herself. And I look at it and go, was that really the best thing for everybody? Because I remember you guys screaming at each other in the hospital and both of us seeing it. I remember this. I remember that. I mean, these are not good happy memories. This was not a happy situation. Could she have been healthier had you guys not been together? I don't know. Could you guys be healthier if you weren't together? I don't know. And even if we go back to the story, like Diana was saying in therapy, none of it was planned. The pregnancy wasn't planned, the marriage wasn't planned, the death wasn't planned. The only thing planned was Natalie. And was Natalie planned to try and fix things? I guarantee you she was. I guarantee you she was the fixer child.  I became that when my sister died. And I mean, like, the reason they got married is because she was pregnant, not because they cared about each other. And I mean, it's hard. The first thing that pops in my head is in friends when Rachel finds out she's pregnant. And Ross is like, well, I guess getting married. And she's like, Why? Because we love each other. No, I'm not getting married to you just because you're the father of this child. We can still raise the child and not be in a relationship. Exactly. And she tells her dad, and her dad gets really mad, and it.  It is socially hard to make a decision that's so different from what socially we're supposed to do. And you can see, like, whether the social pressures are there, and you are dealing with your mental health in a socially acceptable way or not, or a not socially acceptable way. You're both sick. Both Dan and Diana are struggling in this marriage, and because of that, so is Natalie, and and none of this is working well. And would Natalie have suffered like this had they made a more emotionally mature or had they taken care of themselves if they hadn't gotten married? Would they have stayed together after Gabe died? I mean, like, I have multiple friends who end up getting divorced and say,  I would have left them years ago if that marriage hadn't been there, if there wasn't this legally binding marriage to end. Yeah. And I mean, choosing to divorce, choosing to end a relationship is not an easy decision for anyone. I mean, maybe there are people out there where it's the easiest decision in the world.  I don't think it's easy if you're emotionally cognizant. Don't know anybody who has had that as an easy decision. I mean, I know I struggled with it well. And the thing is, you have to make a decision either way. Right. And neither decision is going to be easy. One is going to be significantly harder in the short term that divorce, but one's going to be longer, harder for a longer time, like 17 years that these two have tried to make it work. But let's hear why Dan stayed. Okay, so we have the song. Yeah. Sorry. Oh, that's good. This is why I like art, because it encourages these conversations. So Dan is saying a promise a boy says forever. And Dan and Henry are both saying whatever may come will come through and who can know how when all I know now to be true is this promise I make to.  So  Henry sings like, A boy wonders if I should stay? But Dan is a little  different. He goes, a question. A boy wonders whether the two stay together? The way that they stay for year after year? For love or from fear? Either way, that's the promise I made that day? To the girl who was burning so brightly? Like the light from Orion above? And I will search for her nightly? If you see her? Please send her my love? And a boy was a boy for all seasons? That boy is long lost to me now? And the man has forgotten his reasons? But the man still remembers his vow. Yeah, so he's staying out of obligation. Exactly. But I think this is probably the first time he's realized it, because Diana straight up asked him why. So they keep singing. Dan keeps singing. He's like a promise. A man says forever? A man says I'll never regret or let you? The promise I made to stay? And I stayed true? Knowing one day we'd remember that joy? You'd remember that girl? I'd remember that boy till we do? The promise I made? I'll make it brand new? The promise I made to you? And so he's just like it's a combination of, well, obligation and that promise, but there's also this severe hope for we can get back to that. We can reclaim what was lost. And this is a theme we see with a lot of Dan songs, better than before. Like, we'll just forget all of the hard things and just have a happy life. The bury your head in the sand like an ostrich and pretend like nothing's wrong? Which doesn't work. So I find it interesting, because then we have dan and Diana are standing, staring at each other, but Henry and Natalie are giving each other a hug. And so you kind of see this kind of dichotomy here. And then Gabe with his I'm alive reprise. I am more than memory? I'm what might be? I am mystery? Gabe starts walking towards Diana, and Dan is watching. Diana back away from Dan. Gabe says, Come closer, and Dan goes, Diana, there's nothing there. And she's still backing away. And Gabe goes, I am oldest time and forever young? I am every song that will stay unsung? I'll find you? And Diana goes, oh, no? She catches a glimpse of Gabe and goes, oh, no? And Dan's like, Damn it, this is what he was trying to avoid. And Gabe's, like, remind you, right? And Diana is like, Natalie, come down. Diana runs out of the room, and for a second, Gabe watches her go, but then he stays in the room and looks at Dan and sings. Until you name at me you can't tame me? This is one old game that I can play so well?  Natalie comes down from her room, meets Diana on the staircase. Gabe is following Dan. I'm alive, so alive. The medicine failed, and the doctors lied. I'm death defied, so alive. So Diana heads back downstairs. Henry's waiting. Natalie comes back, and it's like, I can't go to your dance. I have to drive my mom to the doctor. And Henry's like, I'll drive, and Natalie's like, no. And Henry's like, let me help. And Natalie's like, you can't. Like, she they got they had this moment. They got so close, and she's, you know, something happened. Her mom needs to go back to the doctor. And you know what? Screw this. I have to do it on my own. I can't accept any help. Yeah, she doesn't know how to not feel alone in this. Yeah, she does say, hey, I might come later. All right? And Henry's like, I'll wait for you. Like, Natalie and Diana leave. Dan's just staying there, and Gabe is just looming over Dan. I'm alive. Then there's a song called the break, and I love the energy of this one. Like, that guitar is back. They told me that the why I'm just going to read the words because it's so good. Okay. They told me that the wiring was somehow almost firing and screwing up the signals in my brain. And then they told me chemistry, the juice and not the circuitry was mixing up and making me insane? What happens when the burn has healed, but the skin has not regrown? What happens when the cast at last comes off? And then you find the break was always in another bone? And Dr. Madden is there. He's like, by the way, Diana comes to Dr. Madden in the parking lot. So this isn't a scheduled appointment. Like, Dr. Madden's leaving the office, and Diana walks up to him in front of his car. Dr. Madden's like, relapse is common. It's upsetting that the delusional episodes have returned, but it's not unexpected. And Diana's like, they tried a million meds. They strapped me to their beds. They shrugged and told me that's the way it goes. When finally you hit it, I asked you what just did it. You shrugged and said that no one really knows what happens if the medicine wasn't really in control? What happens if the kern sorry. What happens if the cut, the burn, the break was never in my brain or in my blood, but in my soul. And then the energy of the song just slows down, and she repeats that what happens if the cut, the burn, the break was never in my brain or in my blood, but in my soul. And she's like, realizing, maybe this is and I like this too, because.  This is this is the kind of break that's happening after. She reminds she remembers that Gabe is there, right when she tried to confront Gabe before she had an attempted suicide. But now she's remembering Gabe, and she's like, maybe I just need to somehow heal heal my soul instead of messing with my brain, right? So the music changes and new song. Make up your mind catch me I'm falling but the reprice so Dr. Madden is like, make up your mind that this is clarity, clarity that you didn't have before  the treatment is strong, but lasts only so long, so maybe your mind needs more. And she's like, let's say that it's not that. And he's like, hey, the ECT is powerful. It gave you your life back. But the effects fade and additional treatments are almost always needed. And Diana's like, well, that wasn't on the form. He's like, hey, just make up your mind that you'll try again make up your mind that there are moments of light the one thing that's sure is that there is no cure but that doesn't mean that we don't fight.  And then Gabe enters, and he's watching this, and Diana starts to sing Catch me, I'm Falling, and Dr. Madden's like, we'll return to talk therapy. She's, like, sinking and sprawling. There's more work to do. Maybe I'll let myself fall and I like this because in the previous song, in the first song, Gabe sang it, and then Diana joined in. But this time, Diana sings it and Gabe joins in. Yeah, because she's finally healing that soul in this moment. Right? Yeah. And it's almost like there's that shift of Gabe isn't controlling the memory of Gabe isn't controlling her. She has a little control over the memory of Gabe. Yeah. And so they both sing Watch me, I'm falling. Maybe the falling isn't so bad after all. And I love that too. It reminds me of when I told you this quote, and you were like, Whoa. In an episode, I don't remember which one, but I was like, rock bottom became the solid foundation on which I rebuilt my life. They've spent so long trying not to fall. But maybe the falling is necessary. Isn't so bad after all. Yeah. And Dr. Madden, the whole time, is talking, we might have to look at a new drug regimen. There are other promising. Therapies EMD are or rTMS. Right. Like, Diana, you have a chronic illness like diabetes or hypertension. If you leave it untreated, it could be catastrophic. And Diana singing like, watch me, I'm falling watch me, I'm flying somehow surviving.  And I love that. It's just so good. She goes, I understand, but there has to be another way. And he's like, hey, stay with Dr. Madden's. Keep singing. He's like, Stay with me, try again don't walk out on treatment don't lose what you've won you've struggled for years but you've only begun and Diana's, like, my first psychiatrist told me that, according to the manual, grief that continues past four months is pathological and could be and should be medicated. Four months for the life of my child who makes these decisions. And Dr Madden is like, It's a guideline, like, nothing more. She's like, yeah, nothing more. And he's like, hey, stay with me, try again is the medicine magic? You know, it's not it's not perfect, but it's what we've got. And she just says, Goodbye, Dr. Madden, and leaves. So it's kind of this unsure because she's walking away from doctor and last time that this happened, there was this attempted suicide. But what's interesting is that now she walks to Natalie and they have a conversation. Hold on really quick, because I'm thinking, yeah, sometimes you have to break.  To heal almost always. And sometimes you fully have to have a complete and utter break, like the crumble.  And she has that perspective shift, too, which I feel like we talk a lot about in the podcast, and I talk a lot about it to my friends. It's like, you have to have this perspective shift.  I've been trying to not fall for so long. Maybe the falling isn't the problem. We've been trying all of these firing and chemistry, and maybe the problem wasn't in my brain, but in my soul. These are perspective shifts that she hasn't had prior to this. Yeah, they're epiphanies. Yeah. So Natalie and Diana talk. What did he say? He could say I could do more ECT and go back on the meds. And Natalie's like, well, what are you going to do? And Diana goes, I'm going to take you to the dance. It's time for you to start thinking of your own happiness. And Natalie is like, it's not happiness. It's Henry. And her mom goes, but you love him. And it's even through all this haze, she's been able to see that Henry is something special to Natalie. And Natalie is like, you can't just walk away from your doctor. And then there's this really beautiful song that's called Maybe, and in parentheses, next to normal. And so there's like a line in here that's next to normal. And then you can get where the whole title of the musical comes from. But Diana starts singing. She's like, maybe I've lost it at last maybe my last lucid moment has passed but I'm dancing with death really. Who knows? Maybe I'm just tired of the game of coming up short of the rules tired of the shame and maybe you feel that way too I see me and you kind of bringing up this there's been this unspoken comparison between the two. A girl full of anger and hope a girl with a mother who just couldn't cope a girl who felt caught and thought no one could see but maybe one day she'll be tree.  And Natalie starts singing. It's so lovely that you're sharing. No, really, like, I'm all ears. But where has all this caring been for 16 years? For all those years, I prayed that you'd go away for good half the time, afraid that you really would. When I thought you might be dying, I cried for all we'd never be. But there will be no more crying. Not for me and Diana's. Like things will get or you'll see, then they go, you'll see. Natalie goes, not for me, diana, you'll see. Not for me. Diana grabs Natalie, holds her for a moment. And then she goes. Maybe we can't be okay. But maybe we're tough and we'll try anyway. We'll live with what's real, let go of the past. And maybe I'll see you at last. And now I don't believe you. And Natalie starts walking away. And then Diana says, 17 years ago, your brother died of an intestinal obstruction. He was eight months old. I'm sorry we never talked about him. We wanted to give you a normal life. But I realize I have no clue what that is.  And Natalie goes she's singing again. I don't need a life that's normal that's way too far away but something next to normal would be okay  something next to normal that's the thing I'd like to try close enough to normal to get by and so then they go to the dance. And so this is Hey number three. Larissa has tears, and it makes me so happy, because I've cried about this too. And I'm just so happy that I can make Larissa cry. I love making my friends cry.  So they walk in, and Henry's like, hey. Natalie's like, hey. Henry's like, you look really nice. She's like, oh, thanks. Henry's like, I'm surprised you came. She's like, I said that I might. I thought we were over. And alley's like. Well, not tonight. And then will your mom be okay? Well, she might be someday but for now it's all fine well, she's still in my mind can you leave it behind? And she's like, hey, am I crazy? And he goes, let's see this thing through. And she goes, I might end up crazy. And Henry goes, I'll be here for you. And then Natalie kind of has a little bit of a break. And she goes, you say that right here, but then give it a year or ten years or a life. I could end up your wife sitting, staring at walls, throwing shit down the stairs, freaking out at the store, running nude down the street, bleeding out in the bath. All of these things her mom did, they just come tumbling out of her mouth. And then Henry just grabs her and holds onto her and says goes back to their song from earlier. I could be perfect for you he's like, So you could go crazy or I could go crazy, right? Like, it's not just you but sometimes life is insane. But crazy I know I can do because crazy is perfect and fucked up is perfect. So I will be perfect for.  That's so amazing. You listen to the song and it's even better. So they're awesome. And then we go back to the house and Dan is sitting there alone, and Diana enters with suitcases  and she has her song called So Anyway. So anyway, I'm leaving I thought you'd like to know your faithful come what may but clearly I can't stay we'd both go mad that way so here I go and anyway, I'm leaving I guess that you can see I'll try this on my own a life I've never known and I'll face the dread alone but I'll be free with you always beside me to catch me when I fall I'd never get to know the feel of solid ground at all with you always believing that we could still come through. It makes me feel the fool to know that's not true.  What doctors call dysfunction we tried to call romance and true it's quite a trick to tell the dancers from the dance but rather than let chance take me I'll take a chance and then Gabe enters and he starts listening. I'll take it. And Diana keeps singing I'll take a chance on leaving it's that or stay and die I loved you once and though you love me still know it's time for me to fly and then Diana addresses both Dan and Gabe. So she's looking at Gabe and talking to him. I loved you once and though I love you still I know it's time for me to go and so goodbye she nods at Gabe and she leaves.  So Dan sits down, just silent. And Gabe starts walking towards him and Dan talking to himself. This is a new song. I'm The One reprised he's like I'm the one who loved you I'm the one who stayed I am the one and you walked away I am the one who waited and now you act like you just don't give a damn like you never knew who I am and. Yeah.  Sorry. This part's just really powerful to me. I love this song. Gabe gets closer to Dana, starts singing. Gabe goes, I am the one who knows you I am the one you fear I'm the one who's always been here I'm the one who will hear you I know you told her that I'm not worth a damn but I know you know who I am then Dan goes, no. And Gabe goes, I know you know who I am and Dan responds, why can't you just leave me alone? And Gabe's. Like, I know you know who I am. And Dan goes, Why didn't you go with her? And it's kind of like the first time in this entire play that we realize Gabe has grown up in Dan's head too. He's just ignored him. He's been there all those times that we thought only Diana could see Gabe. No, Dan could see him too. And so Gabe's like, because I'm holding on. And Dan's like, let me go. And Gabe's like, I won't let go. And Dan's like, just let me go. And then they both start singing. And I love this because the words apply to both of them. It's just wonderful. I am the one who held you dan held baby Gabe and memory gabe held Dan.  Yeah, I am the one who cried I am the one who watched while you died because what has Dan been doing for 17 years? Slowly dying? Slower suicide. Yeah, I am the one who loved you I tried pretending that I don't give a damn and then Gabe goes but you've always known who I am and for the first time, Dan goes gabe gabriel. And Gabe goes Hi, dad.  So, perfect.  So one more song. Okay. Natalie comes home from the dance dad, what the hell? Why are the lights off? Where's mom? And Dan is like, well, she's gone.  And Natalie is like so it's just you and me now. So then there's the song light. Okay. And Natalie goes. First of all, we need some light. You can't sit here in the dark and all alone. It's a sorry sight. It's just you and me. But we'll live, you'll see. And then Dan sings. Night after night we'd sit and wait for the morning light. But we've waited far too long for all that's wrong to be made right. You're in? And then somewhere else diana appears and sings day after day wishing all our cares away trying to fight the things we feel but some hurts never heal some ghosts are never gone but we go on. We still go on and you find some way to survive and this line, this next line, when I was listening to it, hit me so hard. And you find out you don't have to be happy at all to be happy you're alive.  So then a different day. Henry's like, hey, do you know where she went? And have you heard from her? And Natalie's like, oh, I've heard from her. She's staying with my grandparents. And then they're just, like, teasing. Henry's like, that's a good thing. She's like, well, going home has never been a solution to any of my problems. Henry's like, well, that's what you have me for. She's like, seriously, you're like, number three on the list of my issues. Henry's like, you keep a list. She's like, but don't worry, you're my favorite problem. And so they're like, really happy, right? Yeah. So Natalie sings day after day. Give me clouds and rain and gray give me pain if that's what's real and then Dr. Madden is with Dan on a different part of the stage. And Natalie and Dr. Madden sing it's the price we pay to feel. And Dr. Madden goes, the price of love is lost but still we pay we love anyway.  Dan asks Dr. Madden, I know you can't tell me if you're still treating her. I wonder if she's okay. And Dr. Madden is like, I think she's working on it and she's aware of the risks. So do you think she'll come home? And Dr. Madden's like, it's hard to know. Dan's like, right? He's like, dan, would you like me to recommend someone for you to talk with? And Dan's like, oh, no, wait. Yes, I would. Thank you.  So they sit and they talk, and then Gabe appears, and he's like and when the night has finally gone and when we see the new day dawn we'll wonder how we wandered for so long so blind the wasted world we thought we knew the light we made it'll look brand new. And so then everyone is singing Let it shine dr. Madden gives Dan a card so everyone's singing shine and then it's everyone together, day after day. We'll find the will to find our way knowing that the darkest skies will someday see the sun. And Dan goes and when our long night is done and then Dan and Natalie there will be light. And then everyone there will be light though when we open up our lives sons and daughters husbands, wives and fight the fight there will be light the End. Wow. It's amazing, isn't it? So good. Do you see why I've been bugging you about it for so long? Well, I'm excited to finally get to, like, going to be researching when it's going to be.  On a stage next. But yeah, I mean, it's amazing. Yeah, it's so good. And I love that the resolution isn't yay. Everyone lived happily ever after. The resolution is something reality big enough shifted that there's hope. But that doesn't mean that the struggle is gone. It doesn't mean that everything is better. And I mean, like, just some of the lines in this last song and listening to the song, this particular line is so strong for me. But like, day after day give me clouds and rain and gray give me pain if that's what's real it's the price we pay to feel the price of love is loss but still we pay we love anyway I mean, it's just so beautiful.  It's hard to share it with a lot of people because they'll be like, well, this is really weird. I don't really get it. But for people who've been through stuff, who have hard things, like to see yourself in this musical, it's really cathartic. It's cathartic to listen to. It's cathartic to watch the story. It's cathartic to be seen and to not be left alone in all of this. Right. It's truly astounding and absolutely wonderful and, like, so many different things. Like, I'm sure that you and I could talk for hours and hours about what it means and when this happened and that happened.  It's amazing when you get really good art forms that just speak to you and you might not necessarily know the emotion, but, hey, Dan's feeling this emotion. Maybe that's what I'm feeling, too. Because when he sings his songs, I feel that way. I feel anxious to make everything be perfect because I don't want to face what okay. And then a door opens and it becomes something that you can use to learn and to heal and to grow.  Well. And it's amazing for me because I can look at it and be like, okay, so I can identify this and this person in my life and this and this person in my life, and this is me in this, and then this is this. And it's just stunning to be able to look at it and go, oh, my goodness, look at the parallels to anybody who's gone through something really tough, whether that be trauma, whether that be abuse, whether that be loss of a loved one, whether or not you're grieving someone who's alive or who's passed. I mean, it's still a process, and it's not easy, and  it would be much easier to take the low road. Yeah. And even if you haven't gone through that and you're just trying to do your best to help and you see yourself and Dan, it's an amazing piece of art. I really love it. I'm grateful that let me share it with you for this. Just generally, thank you for joining. But I felt like talking about art and how it helps us in a structured, kind of clinical, detached ways is helpful, but sometimes it's better to just experience art and learn better that way. So hopefully our villainous friends have been able to experience this as well. The next episode, Larissa and I will be talking about why we call the podcast Vilified and kind of use this as an example, because at the end, we realized that Gabe was trying to help, and there was not a single person in this entire play that was a villain. Right at certain points, like, should Dan have said this and not mentioned that she had a son? Should Natalie have taken the drugs? But what is it Henry's fault?  That's life, it's just complex, and there's no black and white way to look at it. So definitely join us for that.  Anything you want to say before we sign off? Larissa,  did you like the musical? Was it fun? Oh, I loved it. I loved it, and it resonated so much, and it's just such a wonderful example of being able to express emotion through.  Art in a  because there's so many different ways you can experience art. It can be passive, it can be active, it can be personally done. It can be something that's being done that you're watching. There's just so many different ways to experience it. Yeah, I loved it. Good. Well, thank you for experiencing this art with me. I'm very excited about it. It just made me very happy. So you'll listen to the songs, I'm sure, Larissa viewers, if you want to listen to it, it's next to normal. It's a purple cover.  Very purple. It should be pretty simple. You can just Google it and whatever. Wherever you listen to your music, you'll be able to find it. Find it on the inner webs. You can also find lyrics on the inner webs, which I really like reading the lyrics as I listened to the song the first time. So that's an idea. But I'm looking forward to all of the messages that Larissa is going to send me as she listens to the music. Because that's going to happen. Yeah, you know it is. Yeah, I know. I'm so excited. All right, everyone, we'll see you next week. Thanks for tuning in. This is VILIFIED.

Hey, friends. It's editing. Janilee here. Just wanted to drop in a little bit and let you know that the ending of this episode is just going to be a little tidbit episode that'll come out later on. The second act ended up taking a little bit longer than I expected, but I hope you enjoyed and keep your eye out for something coming out later this week that has just a few more little examples of how we can use art to heal.

This is the episode transcribed. This is the episode transcribed.